Germany’s Bundesrat, the upper house of parliament, backed a bill to criminalize the denial of Israel’s right to exist on Friday, a motion that constitutional experts said could jeopardize freedom of expression.
According to the bill, anyone denying Israel’s right to exist or calling for its abolition would be punished with a prison sentence of up to five years under the regulation. The bill will be examined by the Bundestag, the lower house of parliament, after its summer recess.
The Germans really love genocide.
Our government sure does. Their enablers probably don’t actively love it, they just can’t be arsed to actually think about the implications of just voting CxU. The reasons range from “I’ve always voted for them” (that just makes it worse) and “they’re Christians” (the fuck they are) over various forms of “I like the status quo” (which they’re making worse for everyone not already rich) to “the evil bad green / left parties are gonna take away my house, my car, make me eat tofu and whatever other propaganda bullshit my favourite sensationalist rag has told me that I believe uncritically”.
They don’t love genocide, they just love not having to care about politics and the cunts they elect abuse that merrily. Of course, there are also genuine genocide fans, but for the most part, it’s more a habitual complacency with a chunk of domestic fearmongering.
As a democratic body, we’ve been slacking off for decades. Now the bill is coming due and the youth get to foot it. We get thrown in with the misguided, the lazy and the assholes. And the worst part is how many of us fall into the “domestic misery -> xenophobia” trap and prove you right.
I can’t even argue with your conclusion. The difference between actively supporting and passively permitting is academic when the results are these pieces of shit in our government.
What does genocide have to do with this bill?
This whole shit about “Right to exist” is extremely absurd.
Never before, anywhere else on the planet, no other country was ever questioned to have the right to exist.
Fuck these genocidal colonialists, trying to smooth ambiguous sentences with acceptance for their genocide.
exactly. does Genovia have a right to exist? that’s the fictional European kingdom from The Princess Diaries. it’s doesn’t exist. but does it have a right to?
Never before, anywhere else on the planet, no other country was ever questioned to have the right to exist.
Even right now Russia questions Ukraine’s right to exist, US questions Venezuela, Colombia, Cuba and Greenland’s right to exist. Britain has in living memory questioned Ireland’s right to exist.
Israel absolutely has a right to exist and it’s fine that’s put to law.
Palestine ALSO has a right to exist and it should also be put to law.
Can we first know what “right to exist” means for the context of a nation state? Surely, Nazi Germany didn’t have a “right to exist”. So, surely it’s not a universal right like a person’s right to exist? This means there are things a state can do that revoke it’s “right to exist”? So, what does it actually mean?
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All states (even Nazi Germany) have a “right to exist” and it cannot be revoked.
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No states have a “right to exist”.
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All states have a right to exist until some defined violation that revokes that right.
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It’s a meaningless phrase that is only used in the context of defending a genocidal apartheid state.
I’m leaning towards thinking they are using the last definition.
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I do not recognize terrorist states. Free Palestine. And fuck you Germany. You never changed.
So you also don’t recognize Palestine because of the atrocities of October 7th? I think there should be protection for both states and for all human beings living there.
Get lost
I think there should be protection for both states and for all human beings living there.
Cool. How do you proposing twisting the arm of the fucking apartheid regime that is currently engaging in genocide to get it to comply with that aspiration? Really open to suggestions.
You believe in 9/11 too probably
What about Palestine’s right to exist? They going to pass a similar law about that?..no?.. Didn’t think so.
Directed at the German parliament
That’s some Zionist bullshit. I guarantee that any criticism of Israel would end up being lumped in.
Already is in Germany. It’s even illegal to protest in Germany in a different language, and that rule was specifically made to target the anti-genocide protests using Palestinian freedom slogans that have been around for decades
Anarchism made a thought crime in Germany.
Then Palestine has a right to exist too.
Some countries hove more rights than some people.
Lmao there is a huge difference between “existing” and “actively deliberately genociding a people and culture they believe are inferior”
That has been illegal already afaik, so what changed?
It was illegal to deny holocaust. Fuck Israhell
No, antisemitism (or really any kind of discriminatory sentiment) is / has been punishable by law already. Among other things, there is precedence that denying Israels right to exist can count as such. While German law is not based on precedence, it shows that it was de facto illegal to do so.
What is legal is to criticise Israel and call out their crimes against humanity, but the political bubble has somehow been convinced it’s not that bad and they are the good ones.
I don’t see Germany making laws about other state’s rights to exist. And also, states don’t have rights to exist.
Don’t be a dumb dumb protecting stupid laws.
I don’t read this as defending it, just explaining the German government’s view of antisemitism.
I’ll go further and note that this broad definition adopted by the government led to multiple instances of Jews being arrested for antisemitism for peacefully protesting the apartheid. I’m not defending the law at all, just lamenting that it’s sadly not new, as far as I can tell.
So I guess I also want to know if anything changed or if they just wanted to pat themselves on the back for formally codifying it.
That was my bad if they weren’t defending the law (see my comment to their response).
And yes, I’m aware of the irony that German Jewish people were arrested for their stance against the Palestinian genocide.
Don’t be a dumb dumb and read stating a plain fact about law as defense of a new law that seems to be mostly symbolic. Or an expression of my take on states for that matter, because neither has happened here.
Then I apologize on both counts. I understood your matter of fact tone as normalizing the overzealous and biased enforcement of anti-hate laws.
I don’t know what “Israel’s right to exist” means. Like, I believe that Israel should exist as a secular, democratic country with fully equal rights for all people regardless of their ethnicity or religion, with the right of Palestinian refugees and their descendants to return, with reparations for the victims of genocide and apartheid, with full accountability for the perpetrators of crimes against humanity, and with a national project overseen by the international community that will effect the deep institutional and educational deradicalization of the population, including a complete political and institutional repudiation of all kind of jewish-supremacist forms of zionism, as well as a German-style Erinnerungskultur, and by having as its Staatsräson a commitment to the defence and security of Palestine. Is it jail for me in the Bundesrepublik or not?
Yes, jail for you. German law is about Israel’s right to exist as a Jewish state (and everything that comes with that which they don’t speak about and ignore).
Fuck ze germans and fuck Israel
Good.
Now lets see one that also criminalises denial of the right for Palestine to exist.
